According to a report in The Australian, Labor plan to impose a ban on electric hot water systems from 2012, in favour of solar systems, in order to cut those ubiquitous greenhouse gas emissions. Read the full story here.
Most household water heating systems heat a tank of water for storage until needed. Maintaining an acceptable temperature is a problem for solar systems after the sun goes down. So electric backup is needed.
I am interested in a new, efficeint electric technology which only heated water as needed, without tank storage. Apparently someone worked out a way of heating water for domestic use by using microwaves. Anyone know how this development is coming along, and when (if) it will ever be available? One of the benefits apparently was that it also got around the problem of having to replace heating tanks as they corroded.
I feel that it would be a mistake to impose by fiat, specific heatiing systems on the community. This would prevent new, simpler and more efficient solutions from being adopted as they develop. Better to let the market push households towards efficiency, by realistic power pricing.
Paul Biggs - "Except in France where they generate at least 75% of electricity via nuclear."
Backed up with pumped hydro from Sweden for peaking power. And they live to regret it:
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines06/0728-06.htm
"The French government announced July 24 that nuclear power plants situated along rivers will be allowed to drain hot water into rivers at higher temperature. The measure is intended "to guarantee the provision of electricity for the country," according to an official note.
France has 58 nuclear power plants, which produce almost 80 percent of electricity generated in the country. Of these, 37 are situated near rivers, and use them as outlet for water from their cooling systems.
The drought accompanying the hot summer has reduced the volume of water in the rivers, and might force some power plants to shut down.
Under normal circumstances, environment rules limit the maximum temperature for waste water in order to protect river flora and fauna.
"For many years now, French authorities have defended nuclear power arguing that it is clean energy, good for the environment, and that it will help combat global warming, for it does not emit greenhouse gases," Stephane Lhomme, coordinator of the environmental network Sortir du Nucleaire (Phase Out Nuclear Power) told IPS.
"Now, with global warming leading to extreme hot summers, we are witnessing that it is the other way round," Lhomme said. "Global warming is showing the limits of nuclear power plants, and nuclear power is destroying our environment."
During the hot summer of 2003, French authorities had allowed nuclear power plants to drain excessively hot water into rivers, leading to considerable damage to flora and fauna, Lhomme said. "
What a shame they do not have solar as well that you do not have to shut down when it gets hot.
Paul Biggs - "It's well known and obvious that greens like to puch intermittent energy sources to replace 24/7 sources."
Yes nuclear is pretty intermittant. When it gets hot they have to shut them down.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/business/energy/5061439.html
" ATHENS, ALA. — The Tennessee Valley Authority shut down one of three units at the Browns Ferry nuclear plant Thursday because water drawn from a river to cool the reactor was too hot, a spokesman said.
The nation's largest public utility shut down Unit 2 about 5:42 p.m. CDT because water drawn from the Tennessee River was exceeding a 90-degree average over 24 hours, amid a blistering heat wave across the Southeast.
"We don't believe we've ever shut down a nuclear unit because of river temperature," said John Moulton, spokesman for the Knoxville, Tenn.-based utility.
He said TVA would compensate for the loss of power by buying power elsewhere. The utility announced earlier Thursday that it was imposing a fuel surcharge on customers because of lower hydroelectric power production caused by drought conditions.""
Pity they didn't have solar which would have been fine.
"Paul's comment about greenwashing and solar only hot water is thus uninformed, and is the kind of bitter, muttered anti-green comment that is so endemic in the comments box of this blog."
It's well known and obvious that greens like to puch intermittent energy sources to replace 24/7 sources. My experience in Greece of solar water heating is that there is no back-up.
We hear so many complaints about non-coal energy sources not being able to replace base load, but getting rid of electric hot water removes a significant demand for base load.
I considered a solar hot water system a few years ago (purely for efficiency and economic reasons) and was told by the manufacturer that they could not guarantee its performance above 600 meters elevation (in Vic.).
Most household water heating systems heat a tank of water for storage until needed. Maintaining an acceptable temperature is a problem for solar systems after the sun goes down. So electric backup is needed.
I am interested in a new, efficeint electric technology which only heated water as needed, without tank storage. Apparently someone worked out a way of heating water for domestic use by using microwaves. Anyone know how this development is coming along, and when (if) it will ever be available? One of the benefits apparently was that it also got around the problem of having to replace heating tanks as they corroded.
I feel that it would be a mistake to impose by fiat, specific heatiing systems on the community. This would prevent new, simpler and more efficient solutions from being adopted as they develop. Better to let the market push households towards efficiency, by realistic power pricing.
Paul Biggs - "Except in France where they generate at least 75% of electricity via nuclear."
Backed up with pumped hydro from Sweden for peaking power. And they live to regret it:
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines06/0728-06.htm
"The French government announced July 24 that nuclear power plants situated along rivers will be allowed to drain hot water into rivers at higher temperature. The measure is intended "to guarantee the provision of electricity for the country," according to an official note.
France has 58 nuclear power plants, which produce almost 80 percent of electricity generated in the country. Of these, 37 are situated near rivers, and use them as outlet for water from their cooling systems.
The drought accompanying the hot summer has reduced the volume of water in the rivers, and might force some power plants to shut down.
Under normal circumstances, environment rules limit the maximum temperature for waste water in order to protect river flora and fauna.
"For many years now, French authorities have defended nuclear power arguing that it is clean energy, good for the environment, and that it will help combat global warming, for it does not emit greenhouse gases," Stephane Lhomme, coordinator of the environmental network Sortir du Nucleaire (Phase Out Nuclear Power) told IPS.
"Now, with global warming leading to extreme hot summers, we are witnessing that it is the other way round," Lhomme said. "Global warming is showing the limits of nuclear power plants, and nuclear power is destroying our environment."
During the hot summer of 2003, French authorities had allowed nuclear power plants to drain excessively hot water into rivers, leading to considerable damage to flora and fauna, Lhomme said. "
What a shame they do not have solar as well that you do not have to shut down when it gets hot.
Except in France where they generate at least 75% of electricity via nuclear.
Paul Biggs - "It's well known and obvious that greens like to puch intermittent energy sources to replace 24/7 sources."
Yes nuclear is pretty intermittant. When it gets hot they have to shut them down.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/business/energy/5061439.html
" ATHENS, ALA. — The Tennessee Valley Authority shut down one of three units at the Browns Ferry nuclear plant Thursday because water drawn from a river to cool the reactor was too hot, a spokesman said.
The nation's largest public utility shut down Unit 2 about 5:42 p.m. CDT because water drawn from the Tennessee River was exceeding a 90-degree average over 24 hours, amid a blistering heat wave across the Southeast.
"We don't believe we've ever shut down a nuclear unit because of river temperature," said John Moulton, spokesman for the Knoxville, Tenn.-based utility.
He said TVA would compensate for the loss of power by buying power elsewhere. The utility announced earlier Thursday that it was imposing a fuel surcharge on customers because of lower hydroelectric power production caused by drought conditions.""
Pity they didn't have solar which would have been fine.
Have had solar hot water for years and when it breaks down ,it gets the boot.Spend most of the time boosting it.Pile of rubish.
"Paul's comment about greenwashing and solar only hot water is thus uninformed, and is the kind of bitter, muttered anti-green comment that is so endemic in the comments box of this blog."
It's well known and obvious that greens like to puch intermittent energy sources to replace 24/7 sources. My experience in Greece of solar water heating is that there is no back-up.
We hear so many complaints about non-coal energy sources not being able to replace base load, but getting rid of electric hot water removes a significant demand for base load.
I considered a solar hot water system a few years ago (purely for efficiency and economic reasons) and was told by the manufacturer that they could not guarantee its performance above 600 meters elevation (in Vic.).